Religion: How Useful.
Honestly, I love Mitt Romney. Who can't love the guy?
Good guy. Great family man. Great Business man. Competent leader.
But persecuted, he is not.
In perhaps one of the most brilliant PR moves a politician has recently made, Mitt gave a big and impressive speech about a problem he really doesn't have and wound up being a victim he really is not.
Plus he wound up finding a place with a PRESIDENTIAL SEAL he could stand before. Clap. Clap.
He looks exceedingly uncomfortable and he's glued to his teleprompter, (click here) but few people noticed that. Overly staged, overly done, and an invented drama that actually served to trivialize the religion question, not expand it.
Bravo for taking what is (wrongly) perceived as an Achilles Heel and turning it into a major marketing tool. But in all honesty almost half of America didn't even know the dude is Mormon.
Mitt gets bonus points for being able to have his face juxtaposed with Kennedy EVERY SECOND.
Mitt gets HUGE bonus points for NOT apologizing for his religion or distancing himself from it.
BUT Mitt gets extra extra points for introducing Conservatives to classic whiney Lib tactics.
Surely Obama is thinking: Why didn't I do something like that. Like a "hey there's nothing wrong with being black" famous speech.
Or Huckabee: "Hey there's nothing wrong with being an evangelical" famous speech.
Or Thompson: "Hey what the hell are you looking at" famous speech.
Or Rudy: "Hey what's wrong with the police walking my girl's dog" famous speech.
Or McCain: "hey what's wrong with me. Period" famous speech.
Or Hillary: "Hey what's wrong with me being a woman" famous speech. Oops. Sorry. Been done 131 times.
All that said, I think Mitt would make a great President. He certainly gets the importance of "the message."
Jamie, Good points on Mitts speech. With all that has or has not been said about his religion I took his little chat to be Kennedyesque in so far as he was pointing out his beliefs about God or what ever he worships should not matter.. Again, "I" felt he doing just what JFK did almost 50 years ago. I heard that chat also.
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Really ? ? ? Mit Romney ? ? ? come on Allman .....
What trash did he say , oh yeah , see you can't have freedom without religion and religion and freedom always work together .....
two words for Mr. Romney : Dousche Bag
That guy is a joke and changes platforms more than people change their clothes .
Whatever happened to "seperation of Church and State" , so here we go with another Great Divider like Mit Romney .
Every election cycle we have an ass clown like him come along and preach the gospel to Americans , haha , right guys ? ? ? how can he be the one if Mike Huckabee is the "Christian Leader" ? ? ? -- that stuff is laughable at best .
It never ceases to amaze me how these populist politicians try to divide the people more than unite them , but with Mit Romney it's never enough Hell He bought The Straw Poll in Florida Before the last debate , hoping he could get a bigger push than the other candidates , he is a cheater and a snake plain and simple .
Please don't vote for a neo-con Messiah , how about an actual president who is a man of integrity for a change ... I think that we as Americans owe it to ourselves and shouldn't even consider Romney a choice .
Write in Mickey Mouse before Mit Romney.
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I hate to disagree with you, or maybe I'm not. Gov. Romney gave an excellent speech but I don't think it's really going to have that big of an effect that you'd think it would. Sure it might have grabbed a few more folks but it more or less just reinforced himself to his supporters.
I do not claim to be an expert in political science but, after 10 years in the Marine Corps, I do know a good strong leader when I see him. I'd have to say all the Republican candidates have that feel of leadership. Unfortunately I don't even know of the other candidates military service,Aside form Sen. McCain. That is my main hangup with all the candidates. I love Sen. McCain (he's a national hero in my book) but I don't think he is electible. As far as I know none of the other candidates have served. I hope I am wrong about that and someone will correct me. Until then I am going with my first impressions. If you have never served in the military how can you justify being in charge of them? This goes for anyone who would like to one day be pres.
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I don't think Mitt needed to reassure anyone about his religion. Mormons, by their actions and strength of character and community, have nothing to apologize for.
I will take his speech for what it was. Uplifting and positive and a reminder of what makes/made this country great. I will be taking another look at Romney. He gets it.
"There are some who may feel that religion is not a matter to be seriously considered in the context of the weighty threats that face us. If so, they are at odds with the nation's founders, for they, when our nation faced its greatest peril, sought the blessings of the Creator. And further, they discovered the essential connection between the survival of a free land and the protection of religious freedom. In John Adams' words: 'We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion... Our constitution was made for a moral and religious people.'
"Freedom requires religion just as religion requires freedom. Freedom opens the windows of the soul so that man can discover his most profound beliefs and commune with God. Freedom and religion endure together, or perish alone.
Religion without freedom = fundamentalist islam, fascism
Freedom without religion = anarchy
"Recall the early days of the First Continental Congress in Philadelphia, during the fall of 1774. With Boston occupied by British troops, there were rumors of imminent hostilities and fears of an impending war. In this time of peril, someone suggested that they pray. But there were objections. 'They were too divided in religious sentiments', what with Episcopalians and Quakers, Anabaptists and Congregationalists, Presbyterians and Catholics.
"Then Sam Adams rose, and said he would hear a prayer from anyone of piety and good character, as long as they were a patriot.
"And so together they prayed, and together they fought, and together, by the grace of God ... they founded this great nation.
"In that spirit, let us give thanks to the divine 'author of liberty.' And together, let us pray that this land may always be blessed, 'with freedom's holy light.'
Amen
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T Heins -
That guy is a joke and changes platforms more than people change their clothes .
Not as smarmy as your girl Hillary Stalin Clinton. Her and Bubba have brought cheating, lying, and fraud to an art form. Her positions have changed so many times, anyone paying attention now has whiplash.
And if your girl is not Hillary, but Ron Paul, you need to take a Prozac. When you can behave like a good little nut, you can have your coloring book privileges back.
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Annie :
what's this supposed to mean ???
Religion without freedom = fundamentalist islam, fascism
first off NO , secondly if you religious nuts would please stop throwing aroung those buzzwords , maybe real change could happen .
and my personal favorite :
Freedom without religion = anarchy
apparently in your opinion , the crusades never happened ? the holocaust perhaps never happened ? or maybe when Americans first were slaughtering natives because they wouldn't buy into a monotheistic system (christianity ) , but were at peace with a polytheistic system .. do your homework before you bring religion into anything please , enough said .
And another piece of Homework on Mit Romney pretty much for anybody would be to Find ONE issue that he hasn't changed platforms on during his entire presidential campaign , please humor me . . . . and accordingly , explain to me why that single issue alone could better the american people .
In My opinion Romney is no better than Hilary , Rudy , Edwards , Obama or any of the other "top-tier" neo-con/neo-lib trash that the government is force feeding us ... and yes , Ron Paul is my guy ... he is not the end to the problems , he is a beginning to the solution .... you might want to consider thinking outside the box for once and cast your vote for him too.
In fact , pound for pound , Ron Paul collectively has more delegates in caucus states than any of the "top-tier" people , that's got to tell you something.
The issue at hand is that Romney preaches his religion , but meanwhile wants to increase war spending ... you can't have it both ways if you are truly an evangelical .
The troops don't want war and the majority of the american citizens don't want it either .. The mission was successful but now it is stale and its time to bring the troops home .... and out of the whole pack , Ron Paul is the only candidate who has regard for their interests , yet another reason everyone should vote for him .
G.W. Bush and his cabinet hi-jacked the United States government with no regard for the consequences or the feelings of the people and by voting for any of your "top-tier" people you are just asking for more of the same ...
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T Heins, Arent you glad you live in a place where you can spew your bullshit and not have your head , hand or ears cut off for sedition , treason or for a plethora of unsubstantiated accusations of conspiracy by the Government. "The troops dont want war?" " The majority of American citizens dont want it either?" Ron Paul is.............. the chant the chant. you are either badly mistaken, misinformed or a Left wing demichantegoger. Ron Paul is NOT going to be elected .Get used to it or apply for a visa.Not credit card..... Bush hi jacked the US gov??? Do you know how STUPID that sounds. What is the chorus to your chant?
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Awww...T Heiny got her widdle feewings hurt.
It's all about feelings with you brainless lefties.
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Sgt Keylor,
I agree that McCain is a hero. He would be strong on the war on terror, I don't think he likes pork, and he is pro-life.
But, his positions on illegal immigration, McCain-Feingold, and coercive interrogations of enemy combatants, have turned a lot of people off. They don't trust him.
As far as the other candidates serving in the military, Duncan Hunter has. He served in the 173rd Airborne and 75th Army Rangers in Vietnam. www.gohunter08.com
I really like Hunter. It is too bad that he has not been able to get 'out there'. His son just returned from Iraq and will be running for his senate seat come '08.
Ron Paul was a flight surgeon in the Air Force. The other candidates, no.
As long as a candidate knows and respects our history, sovereignty, and Constitution, I don't have a problem with him seeking the office of the president.
I have a serious problem with a candidate that tends to be pacifist and anti-military. The Clintons are prime example of that. They have said that they don't care for the military and have proved it by their actions. Bill cut the military and intelligence agencies by a third. His administration put measures in place that prevented agencies from properly communicating with each other and he ignored the terror warning throughout. Look where that got us.
Hillary, on the other hand, would fly into a rage if her orders that military personnel not wear uniforms around the White House, were not heeded.
Sixties retread. She would be worse than him and we can't afford 4 years of looking the other way again.
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Dear Annie,My co blogger and poster is a cry baby leftist nut job with myopia and an extreme case of tunnel vision. Can you help me cure him Abby or should I just shoot it and put out of it's dumb ass misery? If you can help me miss landers I would really appreciate it . P.S. Abby he chants off key and has a nasal twang that is grating.
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Theins,
You can talk about Ron Paul and all your funhouse crap you want....
But why is it that if a discussion on religion comes up that one is dubbed a "religious nut"?
I would assume even your fine Dr. Paul would agree that that is not the image he wishes his followers to portray?
You manage to make great points at times..You know a lot about Ron Paul and his beleifs..wonderful. But you always seem to let your true colors shine through with ingnorant comments or statements....
Which lessens your credibility...much like your man Ron Paul.
Thx LTL
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LTL - I choose not to stoop to that level , in fact Annie made the Nut comment and mine was mearly retalitory .
People just don't like to hear facts that go against their own beliefs , trust me , I deal with that all the time ....
Truth knows no prejudice ...
It's hard to get REAL points across to people that are caught in the red/blue rep/dem left/right paradigm , which is the real pandora's box .
I watched a lewis black stand-up show the other night and I think he says it best . . . " What in the last 15 years of politics makes you think there is a difference between republicans and democrats ? , everyone is hallucinating ! "
I just don't buy into the whole religion as leverage in politics , it's unconstitutional and tacky ....
that and Mit Romney bought a shit load of tickets in the amount of 20 per person in the recent Florida straw poll , where his supporters voted for him numerous times ... while the other candidates played by THE RULES and still made a signifigant showing .... people are hipper these days than they used to be and the waters aren't as safe anymore for slick willy politicians.
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http://valleywag.com/tech/politics/ron-paul-fans-smartmob-republicans-331487.php Ron Pauls Posse is much better.
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Theins,
It is very unfortunate that religion has to be used as leverage. But keep in mind it is very important to many voters.
Romney is most certainly a religious man, it's important to him. If he used this to gain votes, only he knows that and will have to deal with that.
There is a chance also that his speech and its purpose was genuine.
Theins, I don't know how long you have been reading BMA. Your comment about red/blue left/right? That paridigm as you call it, is the reason we are all here. It's why Jamie created this fine site.
Hence "Bull Moose"....I would be willing to bet that no one here no matter which way the vote is not overly enthralled with any candidate running. Personally I think the entire bunch on both sides are disappointing.
That's just my opinion. But not a one has "lit my fire" at this point, so to speak.
I am waiting for certain words to be said from one of them...not sure what those words are...but I'm waiting.
Thx LTL
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Wayne ---
That was a Fred Thompson hosted event , yet again , another place where Paul supporters weren't ALLOWED ...
Seeing isn't always believing ... watch it from another angle and you will see what I'm talking about . ..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcNK3zYc5ts
When The California senator spoke it was intended to be a straw poll ... She spooke for over an hour about Fred Thompson at $ 33 a plate , with $ 5 voting tickets for people participating ..
So , Ron Paul supporters showed up , bought tickets , and wanted to vote .. because word got to them they were not gonna include Ron Paul ... This coming , a week off the tails of Mit Romney's stunt in Florida .
They were just making it fair , you see Wayne , Ron Paul supporters are passionate about his message and want real Change and do whatever it takes to be heard ..
So to the "FlashMob" -- it was really just 100+ people flying their asses up to the polling place after word got out from that Ron Paul was gonna get screwed out of another event , I don't see anybody doing that for Romney .
Truth knows no Prejudice , Wayne .
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( The Above Comment Was Posted By Me ) I messed the "Name" up with the security code .
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I dont care who was doing what to who. The point I am trying to make is they ALL reek. They are pols and as far as I'm concerned they all came out of a septic tank. My point is that Pauls supporters hold him up as some kind of second coming . HE aint. He is NO diff.Get it.NO FRICKING DIFF.Ron Smells as bad as the rest.. this is Wayne not messing with any thing or any body.Get up of your Paul pedestal.........
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Wayne - Unfortunately the system as a whole sucks , but I've grown fond of Ron Paul , just watch a vid or two about him ... not the debates and mainstream shit ... but real Ron Paul interviews with common people and it's pretty easy to see that he knows what he is talking about .
www.ronpaulforpresident2008.com has tons of them
I would never ever begin to say that Ron Paul is the end of the problems , but he very possibly could be the start of the solution .
come on wayne , Ron Paul's god a freakin Blimp for christ's sake ! haha
I hate them all , and I am a "disenfranchised" voter as the media puts it . . . That's why i side with the different game candidate ... unfortunately you can't change the human condition over night and we are always going to have to vote as long as we live in America , so we have to use the means provided and as a people should always pick the guy that doesn't fit the mold to protect ourselves from the dirty dealings of corporate interests's letting big money smash small money , meanwhile wiping out the common man.
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Oh Crap ,I mean "Ron Paul's GOT a freakin blimp" , that made me look bad , haha , Ron Paul isn't a messiah .
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THeins, I hope every body looks at the site you chose for Ron Pauls bona fides. Pardon me if I choose to think that you are not a disenfranchised voter. EVERY ONE of Pauls "ites" is frantic to get him in the Sore knees office. Of late "they " have toned down their rhetoric some but again I refer folks to the site you pasted. Un real........ Michael Moore?Oreilly a puppet?
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If Ron Paul is serious about his cause and is asking for his new "Tea Party"? Then when he loses the Republican nomination he will then run as an independent.
He was asked if he would do that last week and he said he had no interest in parting from the republican party.
If he is true to his cause he will run independent...other wise all the fore father, Constitutional Hero, average citizen line is a bunch of crap... I wonder if he will sign on as an Independent with a quill???
thx LTL
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Micheal Moore/ O'reilly and other pundits --- bring nothing to the table except ideas , I take every one of them with a grain of salt ... I take these "Ideas" and research them and form my own opinion which we all should do.
It's hard to put it into words so I will try : Those anti-pundits are still pundits ... like Keith Oblberman who goes on an "anger" filled rant weekly about bush .... and some people might be sittin back saying , "get 'em Keith !" ... but the truth is that
1. he still has his job he'd get fired if he were a real threat to G.E.'s interests (G.E. owns NBC , lightbulbs , appliances , and Military Technology)
2. The stories they report are the same as the whole day's news . Those stories approved by the media's editors and "national security" interests -- so even if it was a BIG deal , the pundit's rant is still safe to view and won't "get people in the streets"
It's actually a great example you brought to light between Moore and O'reilly .... two polar opposites .
Both seek to tell the "truth" , but both have become very biased as time has went on . Both of them also spin the issues to appeal to their fans .
For example : if they had a red checker piece in front of them ... one would always argue it was red and the other would always argue that it was round .
At the end of the day it is still the same thing , and that's what the people need to worry about .
Imagine America as a baseball league and every citizen is a player in it .. maybe an American/National (rep/dem) league ... everyone votes to change the laws/rules of baseball alone with no real satisfaction , because they are only playing politics one way ..
So in a sense a guy like Ron Paul comes along and offers to the people a whole new game ... Hockey ... not the old game , not the same game , but a new game .
It's a bit heady , spacy narrative but I think you can see the idea.
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Theins,
You don't truly beleive that Michael Moore seeks to tell the truth do you???
The truth with him is, is like so many others...he hates Bush.
Ron Paul is not bringing a different game Theins... He is the kid that brings a hockey stick to the baseball game...
He claims to have all the knowledge of the game... He is the USFL of football...the majority of the fans aren't buying it...
Thx LTL
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THeins.......Very eloquent bullshit but bullshit none the less. This is starting to circle back on itself. I AM DONE.
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Yeah, how is it we always end up on Ron Paul???
See ya tonight BMA!
Thx LTL
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Why did Willard Romney make this speech? He made this speech because many other supernaturalists, particularly the evangelical flavored ones ones, think that The LDS Church is a cult.
I love these disputes. It's like a witch arguing with an astrologer about homeopathy. All religions are false. Mormonism just seems goofier because it is a recent invention and so easy to dismantle. Nevertheless, the absurd claims of Mormons are no less laughable than those made by Jesusists or Mohamadists.
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Robert I totally agree .
In theory , they all have the same goal : Simply , Be good in life .
But , It is the man-made versions of them that present the bullshit element .
No place in politics , no place in schools (unless private) , no place on currency , and no place in global imperialism .
every year its Christmas : Jesus vs. Santa Claus in a showdown to the death .
: :My Presumably imaginary character vs Your presumably imaginary character: :
And grown adults actually fight over this bullshit ....
I named my last post : Muhammed , gimme a friggin break !
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Annie,
Thanks for the info on Duncan Hunter and Ron Paul, much appreciated. I understand you point on that they don't have to have served. I just have alittle bias having served. (hey we all have'em right?)
I agree 110% with you on the Clintons. I was in from 96-06 and know what it was like under Slick Willy. I like how so many Clintonites always miraculously forget that he was the one that opened our trade lines with COMMUNIST CHINA!!! Had to get that out.
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Oh i forgot to add about my problems with the pres having nevered served. There is an old quote, (I forget who said it & quite frankly too lazy to look it up.)
"He who truly wants to go to war surley has never been."
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sgt Keylor............The prez DID serve...
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Mr. McInyre,
I know Pres. Bush "served". I was referring to our future candidates. Like did any of the Dems serve? I don't know. Ms. Annie was kind enough to inform me of Mr. Hunter's & Mr. Paul's service. I am about as far from a Bush Basher as you can get. I'm not going to back him up word fgor word but I'm sure as hell not going to bash him.
Americans need to start respecting the office of the President of the United States of America. Unfortunatley even if it's a Dem holding it. (as my spine shudders and teeth grind)
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Sgt. Keylor,
Although I do not believe that one who has served is anymore a patriot than one who has not....But I do believe that the experience of serving in the military and seeing it's sacrifices and great will, would be an added asset to any President or aspiring President.
Thx LTL
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LTL,
I'm not questioning their patriotism, I'm just asking for more experience. If you are to tell men and women they are to go and fight you should have atleast been in their shoes before. A good saying I learned in the Corps goes; You have to follow before you can lead.
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Sgt Keylor,
I agree 100%. I believe that one of the qualifications for being President is to have honorably served in the military. To be the Commander in Chief of the US military and never having served is an insult to those that do serve. A civilian can NEVER truly understand the sacrifices our military makes.
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